Interview with Carlos Castaneda
INTERVIEW WITH CARLOS CASTANEDA
Foreword by Volume:
In 1960 a young anthropologist, a student at UCLA, Carlos Castaneda went to Mexico for the preparation of his dissertation on psychotropic plants. There will know a Yaqui Indian Don Juan Matus who, relying on the need for knowledge of hallucinogenic plants of young Castaneda, introduced him slowly into the path of initiation of warriors. The life of a young anthropologist is completely different direction: from a mere scholar is himself to be absorbed by the spiritual practices of the Indian master himself up to become a wizard, a true warrior, and leader of the group of apprentices of Don Juan. His story is described in the books published by the same Castaneda, at which time, though contesting the veracity, devoted the cover in 1973, and describes the impact of a Western man with the mysteries of the spiritual world, a world in which very large practices ritual and meditative blend with magical elements and stregonici in order to lead man to his highest transcendent form.
The books of Carlos Castaneda are: 1968 - The Teachings of Don Juan (also translated as Teachings of Don Juan), 1971 - A Separate Reality, 1972 - Journey to Ixtlan, 1974 - The Island of the Tonal, 1977 - The Second Ring of Power, 1981 - The Eagle's Gift, 1984 - The Fire from Within, 1987 - The Power of Silence, 1993 - The Art of Dreaming, 1997 - Tensegrity, 1997 - The Active Side of Infinity, 1998 - The Wheel Time.
INTERVIEW WITH CARLOS CASTANEDA Daniel Trujillo Rivas
One for the magazine Mismo, Chile and Argentina, in February 1997, published with the permission of One Mismo. Copyright 1997 Laugan Productions.
Question: Mr. Castaneda, for years she remained in absolute anonymity. What prompted the change to this condition and to speak publicly about the lessons that she and her three companions have received from the nagual Juan Matus?
Answer: What compels us to spread the ideas of Don Juan Matus is a need to clarify what he taught us. For us this is a task that can no longer be postponed. The other three of his students and I have reached the unanimous conclusion that the world in which Don Juan Matus introduced us is within the perception of all human beings. We discussed amongst ourselves on what was the correct road to take. Remain anonymous as we had proposed Don Juan? It was not an acceptable option. The other way was possible to spread the ideas of Don Juan: a much more dangerous and challenging, but the one that we believe, has the dignity with which Don Juan has permeated all his teaching.
Q: Considering what you said about the unpredictability of the actions of a warrior, we have supported for three decades, we can expect this public phase lasts for a while? Until when?
A: There is no way for us to establish a time criterion. We live according to the conditions proposed by Don Juan and there never deviate. Don Juan Matus gave us a terrific example of a man who lived by what he said. And I say that is a terrific example because it is the hardest thing to emulate; be monolithic and at the same time have the ability to cope with anything. This was the way in which Don Juan lived his life.
Given these assumptions, the only thing you can be a mediator is impeccable. You are not players in this cosmic game of chess, you're just pawns on the chessboard. What decides everything is energy conscious and impersonal that sorcerers call intent or the Spirit.
Q: As I noted, the orthodox anthropology, as well as the supposed defenders of the cultural pre-Columbian America, undermine the credibility of his work. The belief that his work is merely the product of his literary talent, which, however, is exceptional, continues to exist today. Also in other fields, accused of having double values because, presumably, his life and his activities contradict what most would expect from a shaman. How can allay these suspicions?
A: The cognitive system of the Western forces us to rely on preconceived ideas. We base our judgments on something that is always "a priori", for example the idea of what is "orthodox." What is orthodox anthropology? That taught in university lecture halls? What is the behavior of a shaman? Wear feathers on their heads and dance for the spirits?
I am thirty years that people accused Carlos Castaneda have created a fictional character just because what I report disagrees with the "a priori" anthropological, the ideas established in classrooms or in the field of anthropological work. In any case, what don Juan introduced me to apply only to a situation that requires total action, in these circumstances is very little or almost nothing of bias.
I've never been able to draw conclusions about shamanism because to do so we must be active members in the world of shamans. To a social scientist, say for example a sociologist, is very easy to arrive at sociological conclusions about any subject related to the Western world, because the sociologist is an active member of the Western world. But how can an anthropologist, which passes more than two years studying other cultures, to reach safe conclusions in that respect? It takes a lifetime to acquire membership in a cultural world. I have worked for more than thirty years in the cognitive world of shamans of ancient Mexico, and frankly, I do not think this would allow us to draw conclusions or even to propose.
I discussed this with people from different disciplines and they seem to understand and agree with the premises I'm presenting. But then they turn around and forget every thing that they had agreed and continue to support academic principles "orthodox", without worrying about the possibility of an absurd error in their conclusions. Our cognitive system appears to be impenetrable.
Q: What is the purpose of not allowing himself to be photographed, to record his voice or disclose your biographical data? This could affect what she has achieved in his spiritual work and if so, how? Do not think that knowing who you really are may be useful for some sincere seekers of truth as a way of corroborating that is really possible to follow the path that she promulgates.?
A: In reference to photographs and personal data, the other three apprentices of Don Juan and myself follow his instructions. For a shaman like don Juan, the main idea behind the refrain from disclosing personal information is very simple. It 's imperative to set aside what he called "personal history". Move away from "me" is something extremely annoying and difficult. What shamans like don Juan seek is a state of fluidity where the "me" personnel matters. He believed that the absence of photographs and personal affects anyone who enters this field of action in a positive, though subliminal. We have the constant habit of using photographs, recordings and personal data, each of which comes from the idea of personal importance. Don Juan said it was better not to know anything about a shaman, so instead of meeting a person, you come across an idea that can be sustained, the opposite of what happens in the everyday world where we are faced only people who have numerous psychological problems but no ideas, all these people filled to the brim with "me, me, me".
Q: Those who follow it, as they should interpret the advertising and commercial infrastructure on the side of his literary work and the knowledge that surrounds her and her companions spread? What is your real relationship with Cleargreen, Incorporated and other companies (Laugan Productions, Toltec Artists)? I'm talking about a commercial connection.
A: At this point in my work I needed somebody to represent me in the dissemination of ideas of Don Juan Matus. Cleargreen is a company that has great affinity with our work, as well as Laugan Productions and Toltec Artists. The idea of spreading the teachings of Don Juan in the modern world implies the use of artistic and commercial vehicles that are not on my personal scale. As a company having an affinity with the ideas of Don Juan, Cleargreen Laugan Productions and Toltec Artists are able to provide the means to disseminate what I will divulge.
In the impersonal society there is always a tendency to dominate and transform everything is presented to them and adapt it to their own ideologies. If it were not for the sincere interest of Cleargreen Laugan Productions and Toltec Artists, everything said by Don Juan at this time would be transformed into something else.
Q: Is there a large number of people who in one way or another, "attached" to her to gain public notoriety. What is your opinion about the actions of Victor Sanchez, who played and reorganized your teachings to develop a personal theory? And the assertion by Ken Eagle Feather who was chosen by Don Juan to be his disciple, and that Don Juan came back just for him?
A: Actually, there are a large number of people who call themselves my students or students of Don Juan, who I never met and who, I can assure you, Don Juan never met. Don Juan Matus was exclusively interested in the perpetuation of his lineage of shamans. He had four apprentices that are here today. He had others who left with him. Don Juan was not interested in teaching his knowledge, he taught his disciples to continue his lineage. Because they can not continue the lineage, his four disciples are obliged to disseminate his ideas.
The concept of a teacher who teaches his knowledge is part of our cognitive system but is not part of the cognitive system of the shamans of ancient Mexico. Teaching was absurd for them. Transmit his knowledge to those who would perpetuate their lineage was a different matter.
The fact that there are a number of individuals who insist on using my name or the name of Don Juan is simply an easy maneuver to take advantage of it without too much effort.
Q: We consider that the word "spirituality" means a state of consciousness in which human beings are fully capable of controlling the potential of the species, something accessible from the transcendence of mere animal condition through a tough preparation psychic, moral and intellectual. And 'you agree with this statement? Com 'is integrated into the world of Don Juan in this context?
A: For Don Juan Matus, a pragmatic and extremely sober shaman, "spirituality" was empty ideality, an assertion with no basis that we believe will be very beautiful because it is covered concepts of literary and poetic expressions, but it never goes beyond that.
Shamans like don Juan are essentially practical. For them there is only a predatory universe in which intelligence or awareness are the product of the challenges of life and death. He considered himself a navigator of infinity and said that to navigate the unknown, like a shaman, one needs unlimited pragmatism, boundless sobriety and liver of steel.
In view of all this, Don Juan believed that "spirituality" was simply a description of something impossible to achieve within the patterns of the world of everyday life, and that was not a true way to act.
Q: You said that his literary activity, as well as that of Abelar Taisha and Florinda Donner-Grau, is the result of instructions of Don Juan. What is the purpose of this?
A: The purpose of writing these books was given to Don Juan. He asserted that even if you are not writers can write, but writing has transformed from a literary action in action shamanistic. What decides the subject and conducting a book, not the mind of the writer but rather a force which shamans consider to be the basis of the universe, and they call intent. And 'the intention that decides the production of a shaman who is a literary or any other kind.
According to Don Juan a practitioner of shamanism, has the duty and obligation to saturate himself with all the information possible. The work of shamans is to inquire carefully about everything that could have related topics of interest to them. The shamanistic act is to abandon all interest in directing the course of the information taken. Don Juan used to say: "That which organizes the ideas that spring up from such a source of information is the shaman, is intent. The shaman is simply a conduit impeccable. "For don Juan shamanistic writing was only a challenge, not a literary task.
Q: If you allow me to assert what follows, his literary work presents concepts that are closely related to Eastern philosophical teachings, but it contradicts what is commonly known about the indigenous culture of Mexico. What are the similarities and differences between one or the other?
A: I have not the slightest idea. I'm not an expert either. My work is a phenomenological relationship to the cognitive world to which don Juan Matus introduced me. From the point of view of phenomenology as a philosophical method, it is impossible to make assertions that are related to the phenomenon in question. The world of Don Juan is so vast, so mysterious and contradictory, that does not lend itself to an exercise in linear display, the most we can do is describe it, and that alone is a supreme effort.
Q: Assuming that the teachings of Don Juan have become part of occult literature, what is your opinion about other teachings in this category, such as the Masonic philosophy, the Rosacrucianesimo, Hermeticism and disciplines such as the Kabbalah, the Tarot and Astrology when we compare them to nagualism? Have you ever had any contact with or maintains any of these or their devotees?
A: Again, I have no idea what the background, or views of these subjects and disciplines. Don Juan introduced us to the problem of navigating the unknown, and this requires all of our available effort.
Q: Some concepts of his work, as the assemblage point, the energy filaments that make up the universe, the world of inorganic beings, intent, stalking and dreaming, have an equivalent in Western knowledge? For example, there are some people who believe that the man seen as a luminous egg is a way to define the aura.
A: As far as I know, nothing of what don Juan taught us seems to have a counterpart in Western knowledge.
Once, when Don Juan was still here, I spent a year in search of gurus, teachers and wise men to give me a hint of what they were doing. I wanted to know if there was anything in the world at that time, similar to what don Juan said and did.
My resources were very limited and only took me to meet celebrated masters who had millions of followers and unfortunately I did not find any similarity.
Q: Focusing specifically on his literary work, his readers find different Carlos Castaneda. First, we find a somewhat incompetent Western scholar, permanently confused by the power of old Indians like don Juan and don Genaro (mainly in The Teachings of Don Juan, A Separate Reality, Journey to Ixtlan, The Island of the Tonal, and The Second Ring of Power ). Later we find an experienced shaman apprentice (The Eagle's Gift, The Fire from Within, and particularly in The Art of Dreaming). If you agree with this assessment, how and when it ceased to be the one to become the other?
A: I do not consider myself a shaman or a teacher or a student of shamanism to an advanced level; n 'I consider myself an anthropologist or a social scientist in the western world. My presentations were all descriptions of a phenomenon that is impossible to discern under the conditions of linear knowledge of the Western world. I could never explain what don Juan was teaching me in terms of cause and effect. There was no way to predict what was going to say or what was to happen. In such circumstances, the transition from one state to another is subjective, and not something worked out, premeditated or a product of wisdom.
Q: You can find episodes in his literary work that is really incredible for the Western mind. How can one who is not an initiate verify that all those "separate realities" are real as you claim?
A: It can be easily verified by involving your entire body instead of one mind. You can not enter the world of Don Juan intellectually, like a dilettante seeking fast, reliable knowledge. Nor, in don Juan's world, nothing can be verified with certainty. The only thing we can do is arrive at a heightened state of awareness that allows us to perceive the world around us in a more inclusive. In other words, the goal of the shaman Don Juan is to break the parameters of historical perception and daily and receiving the unknown. This is why he called himself a navigator of infinity. He asserted that infinity is behind parameters of daily perception. To break these parameters was the aim of his life. Because it was an extraordinary shaman, he instilled that same desire in all four of us. Forced us to transcend the intellect and incorporate the concept of breaking the parameters of historical perception.
Q: You assert that the basic characteristic of human beings is to be "recipients of energy." Refers to the movement of the assemblage point as a necessary factor for perceiving energy directly. How can this be useful to a man of 21 st century? According to the concepts defined above, how can the achievement of this goal to help the spiritual progress of someone?
A: The shamans like don Juan assert that all human beings have the ability to see energy directly as it flows in the universe. They believe that the assemblage point, as they call it, is something that exists in the sphere of man's total energy. In other words, when a shaman perceives a man as energy that flows in the universe, sees a glowing ball. In the luminous ball, the shaman can see a point of greatest brightness, located at the shoulder blades, approssimativamene at arm's length behind them. The shamans say that perception is assembled here, that the energy that flows in the universe is transformed here into sensory data, and sensor data are then interpreted, resulting in the world of everyday life. Shamans claim that we are taught to interpret, and thus to perceive.
The pragmatic value of perceiving energy directly as it flows in the universe is the same for a man of 21 th century or a man of the century 1. It allows him to push the limits of his perception and use this growing inside of her world. Don Juan said that would be amazing to see the order directly to the wonder and chaos of the universe.
Q: You recently presented a physical discipline called Tensegrity. Can you explain what exactly? What is its purpose? What spiritual benefit can get a person to practice individually?
A: According to what don Juan Matus taught us, the shamans who lived in ancient Mexico discovered a series of movements that when executed by the body that determined a physical and mental well that they decided to call those movements magical passes.
Don Juan told us that through their magical passes, those shamans reached a heightened level of consciousness that allowed them to perform indescribable feats of perception.
Over the generations, the magical passes were only taught to practitioners of shamanism. The movements were surrounded by massive secrecy and complex rituals. This is the way in which don Juan learned them and this is the way in which taught them to his four apprentices.
Our effort has been to extend the teaching of those magical passes to anyone who wanted to learn. We called them Tensegrity, and we have transformed from specific movements only relevant to each of the four disciples of don Juan, a general movement to suit everyone.
Practicing Tensegrity, individually or in groups, promotes health, vitality, youth and a general sense of wellbeing. Don Juan said that practicing the magical passes helps to accumulate the energy needed to raise awareness and to expand the parameters of perception.
Q: In addition to his three companions, the people who attend his seminars, he met other people, such as Chacmools, the pursuers of Energy, the Elements, the Blue Ranger ..... who are they? They are part of a new generation of visionaries led by you? If so, how you can become part of this group of trainees?
A: Each of these people is to be a specific Don Juan Matus, as leader of his lineage, asked us to wait. He predicted the arrival of each of them as an integral part of a vision. Since the lineage of Don Juan could not continue, because the energetic configuration of the four students, their task was transformed from perpetuating the lineage to close it, if possible with a gold buckle.
We are in no position to change these instructions. N 'we can seek or accept apprentices or active members of the vision of Don Juan. The only thing we can do is to accept the designs of Intent.
The fact that the magical passes, protected with such jealousy for so many generations, are now taught, is proof that you can not really in an indirect way, become part of this new vision through the practice of Tensegrity and following the premises of the way of the warrior.
Q: Readers of Infinity, you used the term "surfing" to describe what they do sorcerers. Were hoisting sails to begin soon the definitive journey? The lineage of Toltec warriors guardians of this knowledge, you will end up with?
A: Yes, that's correct, the lineage of Don Juan ends with us.
Q: Is there a question I'm often asked: the way of the warrior as they include other disciplines, spiritual work for couples?
A: The road warrior's includes everything and everyone. There may be an entire family of impeccable warriors. The difficulty lies in the terrible fact that individual relationships are based on emotional investments, and when the practitioner really puts into practice what he / she has learned, the relationship breaks up. In the everyday world, the emotional investments are not normally tested, and live an entire life waiting to be reciprocated. Don Juan said that I was an investor dies hard and that my way of living and feeling could be described simply: "I give only what others give me."
Q: What aspirations of a possible improvement should have someone who wants to work spiritually according to the knowledge disseminated in his books? What would you recommend to those who wish to practice the teachings of Don Juan by yourself?
A: There is no way to put a limit on what can be done individually if the intent is an impeccable intent. The Teachings of Don Juan are not spiritual. I repeat that the issue has emerged again and again. The idea of spirituality does not fit with the iron discipline of a warrior. The most important thing for a shaman like don Juan is the idea of pragmatism. He destroyed my ambition and made me see that, as a true Westerner, I was neither pragmatic nor spiritual. I came to understand that repeated the word "spirituality" to contrast it with the world of the mercenary aspect of daily life. I wanted to escape the commercialism of the world of everyday life and a strong desire to do so I called spirituality. I realized that Don Juan was right when he claimed that arrived at a conclusion, what I considered to define spirituality. I did not know what I was talking about.
What I'm saying might sound presumptuous, but there is no other way to say it. What a shaman like don Juan wants is to increase awareness, that is to be able to perceive with all the human possibilities of perception, this implies a monumental task and a purpose inflexible, which can not be replaced by the spirituality of Western man.
Q: Is there anything that you would like to tell people about the American South, especially in Chile? He would like to make some other statement in addition to his answers to our questions?
A: I have nothing to add. All human beings are at the same level. At the beginning of my apprenticeship, don Juan Matus tried to make me see how the situation was common to all man. I, for South America, I was very involved, intellectually, with the idea of social reform. One day I turned to Don Juan what I thought was an absolute question: How can remain unmoved by the terrible situation of his fellow men, the Yaqui Indians of Sonora?
I knew that a certain percentage of the Yaqui population suffered from tuberculosis and that, because of their economic situation, could not be cured.
"Yes," said Don Juan, "It 'a very sad thing but, you see, although your situation is very sad, and if you think you are in better condition than the Yaqui Indians, you're wrong. In general, the human condition is in a dreadful state of chaos. No one is better than another. We are all human and that they are going to die, but be aware of this, there is no remedy for us. "
This is another point in the pragmatism of the shamans: to become aware that we are beings that are going to die. They say that when we learn that, everything takes on a transcendental order and measure.
